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Scott L.P.
USA
1022 Posts |
 Posted - 07/24/2004 : 01:58:27 AM
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You can get it even cheaper under the Ivercide name.
Scott L.P. |
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RSmith
USA
2402 Posts |
Posted - 07/24/2004 : 4:44:28 PM
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.27% (Swine Label) runs $35.00 for 200ml !
Adirondack Kennel
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trailbound
USA
410 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 11:17:00 AM
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This may be a dumb question, but why is Panacur used to worm dogs? I guess the question is, if I am worming with Ivomec and Strongid, what is Panacur getting that the other two dewormers aren't? And, I am assuming you are talking about the Panacur Horse wormer?
K
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 12:31:51 PM
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My God, don't you people ever sleep?????!!!! Or work??? Geeeze Leweeeeze. I'm running 24/7 all summer. Last night at 10:30 PM I had my first meal of the day (breakfast?) I haven't been logged on for a month and thought sure cancer had been cured and all was quiet on the mushing front. Doesn't anyone work for a living anymore? Just surf the net? Good grief!
Well, here it goes. Read closely for it'll be another month before I swing the free time to get back on line. I'll take your comments in chronological order.
First, yes, as Dr. Lee says, you can treat with ivermectin for heartworm prevention only, along with pyrantel pamoate (strongid, nemex, etc.)for adult intestinal worms at the same time. The ivermectin dose for PREVENTING heartworms is 4 micrograms per kilogram body weight. The worm-killing dose is 100 to 400 micrograms per kilogram body weight - depending on which worm specie. That's 25 times to 100 times LESS ivermectin to prevent heartworm infection as to kill adult intestinal worms. Therefore, there is no danger in "overkilling?" adult worms. Nemex gets the rounds, heartguard prevents the heartworms.
Panacur (fenbendazole) kills the rodent-carried tapeworms (Taenia), but not the flea-carried tapeworms (Dipylidium). This is why Dr. Lee suggested a flea vector, as Panacur did not help you.
Tapeworm corrections: First, I adore Dr. Lee, who is extremely intelligent and knows tons about thyroid issues and internal medicine, which is why I invited her to Alaska to speak to the sled dog veterinarians. However, no one can know everything about everything and there's a few issues regarding tapeworms which need to be cleared up. I'll still buy you a beer, if you forgive me, Justine.
One, Taenia-type tape worms are carried by rodents and lagomorphs, like mice and bunnies. Also ruminants, like cows and sheep. If your dogs are snarfing up rodents who attempt to scurry through the kennel on a dare or are just plain suicidal and get snarfed up by the dogs, then the dogs will get the taeniid type of tapeworm. This can happen in Alaska or anywhere there are lil' critters scurrying around (meals on wheels for sled dogs). Taeniid tapeworms are killed by any drug with praziquantel such as Droncit, Drontal, Drontal-Plus, etc. AND by the benzimidazole "fenbendazole" such as Panacur. Mebendazole and albendazole don't work, as far as I know. "Cestex," which is ipsiprantel, also works.
"Flea-borne" tape worms, known as Dipylidium, are also vectored by the dog louse, Trichodectes, which lives on the dog. Because the louse lives on the dog all the time, and not in the environment, it will be happy in Alaska, as long as there is a Permanent Fund and oil production to keep Alaskans there. Thus, you don't need fleas in Alaska to have flea tapeworms -- just lousy Alaskans, and boy are there a bunch of those! Just kidding -- lice are VERY species specific and you can't get a dog louse from your dog, which is why when we occassionally find a human pubic louse in a dog fecal exam, well, never mind.....
Cystic tapeworms are carried in the flesh of moose (hydatid tapes) or lemmings and voles (alveolar tapes). Not racoons. ('Coons can kill you with different type of round worm!) Dog's don't get cystic tapeworms from eating feces, but from eating the cystic meat of a dead moose or a dead lemming. These are the dangerous tape worms to humans. If a human eats dog feces, oh yum, the human becomes the moose or the lemming and cysts form in our bodies, such as our livers or lungs or brains and we could die. Cystic tapes are killed in dogs with praziquantal (Droncit, etc.) but only somewhat with ipsiprantel(Cestex) and not at all with fenbendazole (Panacur). Thus, for the Iditarod, the dogs are treated with praziquantel and not the others (and that's actually for political reasons, not biological ones, because of the worm's life cycle, but please don't get me started on that one!
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 1:27:34 PM
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To expand on Dr. Lee's excellent comments: Droncit is just praziquantel and will kill all tapes. It's the gold standard. "Drontal" is praziquantel plus pyrantel pamoate. In other words, the Drontal "cocktail" kills all tape worms (with prazi...) and the hooks and rounds (with pyrant..). It gives the company a marketing edge over, say ivermectin, which won't kill tapes. "Drontal-Plus" has prazi... plus pyrantel....plus febantel. Febantel gets converted in the liver into fenbendazole (Panacur), so now the Drontal-Plus will kill the tapes (prazi), hooks and rounds (pyrant), AND whip worms (fenbendazole). This is the super cocktail marketing edge. It does not kill politicians or other parasites.
If you are using a 200 microgram per kilogram body dosage of ivermectin for the heartworm, hookworm, roundworm, whipworm, and mother-in-law infestions, then it is a waste of money to use Drontal-Plus for tapes only. Drontal alone is far good enough. However, if you want to vary de-wormers occassionally, then skip the ivermectin when there are no mosquitos (late fall prior to race season) and de-worm for everything with Drontal-Plus.
The opossum is definately not sleeping. The issue is not mosquito species but temperatures for heartworm larvae development and it is cumulative. In Minnesota, we need about two weeks of temperatures at or above 55F, or so, for the heartworm larvae to develop within the mosquito gut. Thus, they develop slowly in the spring and fast in the summer. This is also why most people start and end their heartworm prevention too early. The larvae have had all summer to develop in the mosquitos so the fall is more important than the spring, when the cold nights of spring slow down the development of the first batch of the heartworms. In the fall, the microfilaria are already developed so the cold nights don't matter. Remember, first the mosquitos have to hatch, then bite an infected dog, then live long enough for the heartworm larvae to develop. Therefore, heartworm prevention should last until a month after the last killing freeze that kills all the mosquitos.
As an aside, cystic tapeworm eggs in Alaska can survive to minus 60 degrees F. But, not in Ohio. Therefore, the 'Possum's contention that "Global Warming" changes may produce, over time, more cold-tolerant heartworm microfilaria in a warming Alaska is not off the mark. Wow. A big-picture thinker amongst us. Thanks. It gets lonely out here.
Regarding fleas and climate. You are all forgetting that the issue is "Micro-climate" not "Macro-climate" as well as the species of fleas. If a camel urinates in the desert, the sand at that point is not dessicated. Homes in Alaska and the Yukon don't have zero humidity inside and house dogs and cats can definately have fleas. Kennel fleas are less likely, but not impossible. And don't forget those lice.
I used to use teaching slides showing the mirgation of endemic heart worm disease in Minnesota as it crept up the Mississippi river valley from Loozyanna to the North Star State from the early 1940s to the 1990s. Very impressive and methodical. Then, I got a hold of a great map of Montana showing the expansion of heartworm disease there. As one would predict, almost all of the dogs, but NOT all, were from outside Montana (pets and huntin' hounds). Second, the concentrations of infections were around the major cities: Billings (industrial), Helena (capital), Bozeman (educational), Butte, (mining), which is no surprise. These cities also are by water sources, as virtually all cities are (even Phoenix is on the Salt River - such as it is). The troublsome cases in Montana were the endemic cases along the eastern plains by the Missouri River. The water and mosquito source I get, the carrier I don't. Sure there are imported dogs on the eastern side but a critical mass population is needed to increase the probability of a random mosquito biting an infected and then uninfected dog. Obviously, it happens.
The migration to Minnesota happened because there were no good preventives until recently and Minnesota was too cold, we thought. The importation to Montana happened because we let down our guard. Montana is too cold and dry, we tought. The movement to Alaska will probably happen because we think the state is too cold and remote.
Alaska boasts some 3 million lakes and God knows how many wetlands. Plus, lots of tourism and some immigration as well as sled dog sales -- luckily the good ones are usually sold south. But, just as with Minnesota and Montana, it's only a matter of time. The good news is you and I will probably not be around long enough to see it. The coldness and remoteness will slow things down, we think. Also, the widespread use of ivermectin at high dosages among mushing kennels for all round-type worms will have a protective effect.
Have a great late summer.
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 2:30:07 PM
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Gack. There's a ton of stuff discussed on this chat line on ivermectin. Some of it is even correct. For starters, you could check back on the things I wrote in a different heading last month. Look under Dumb Ideas from Dr. Vanek, or some such.
But, first let me dispense with one final bit of misinformation regarding fleas. Adult fleas spend virtually all of their adult life on the dog. Years ago, it was thought that fleas jumped on and off to get a happy meal at the doggy drive-thru. Not so. They will only jump off willingly if the infestation numbers are too high -- like moving to Alaska from Los Angeles. The misunderstanding comes from those who confuse "adult" with "life cycle". The flea's "life cycle" is spent mostly off the dog, but that's because the flea egg, larva and pupa are on the ground in the dog's nest. So, as a percentage of total time, the adult is only a small part of the flea's total life. However, once on the dog, it generally tends to stay -- heck that's where the kitchen is!
Starting on ivermectin: First problem: yes, ivermectin is just as effective if given orally as injectable (well, okay, 95% available). The problem here is that dogs are "monogastrics". They have only one stomach. In ruminants, like cattle and sheep, which have a stomach and three fore-stomachs (no, they do not have "four" stomachs -- they have "fore" stomachs, pouches ahead of the real stomach), the ivermectin is only 25% to 33% available because it is de-activated in the rumen (one of the three fore-stomachs). Hence, it is injected into ruminants to by-pass digestion by the fore-stomachs. (Horses also are monogastrics and it is given to equines as a paste. Please, please don't inject your dogs with a horse paste.) Give it orally.
Ivermectin is dangerous to collies, and similar herding dogs, at high dosages. It is not dangerous at the 4 microgram per kilogram body weight dosage, as formulated in Heartguard and Heartguard Plus. Thus, these products are approved for ALL canines.
When ivermectin is given at a dosage of around 50 micrograms per kilogram bw to about 1/3 of smooth and rough-coated collies carrying a specific gene allowing the drug to cross the blood/brain barrier, those animals will begin to show signs (not symptoms) of an anesthetic overdose. They will show dilating pupils, salivation, wobbly rear ends, forget their social security numbers, etc. At 100 micrograms per kilogram body weight the signs will worsen and the dogs will become ataxic, like like gold miners at the "Pit" in Dawson City on a Friday night. At 200 micrograms per kilogram body weight they will go the way of all flesh without heroic intervention by the likes of Dr. Lee or one of her equally talented colleagues. And for major bucks, I might add.
In most collies, this will not happen. However, short of genetic mapping and testing (actually on the horizon) we don't know which are which, and so it's a crap shoot. The biggest problem has been with AKC show breeders (please don't get me started on them!) who want to blame ivermectin, or ethoxyquin, or the phase of the moon, or Al Qaeda for why their grand champion Poopsie died of serious, reckless, egomaniacal inbreeding. (I warned you not to get me started!)
Anyway, if a collie breeder really wanted to know if his/her collie was susceptible, they would take the dog to their veterinarian and, under close observation, give the dog a dose of 50 micrograms per kilogram body weight and look for signs similar to an Alaska Pale Ale overdose at Gwinnie's. If no signs, then the dog could be dosed at 100 micrograms per Kg bw, etc., on up.
But why?
Just give Lasie and Shep Panacur or Nemex or Drontal Plus or Heartguard Plus, etc., etc.
Duh.
On the other hand, there's the musher with half a job and 300 dogs. Oops. Luckily, there's not a lot of collie blood in most Alaskans, but some, in most racing huskies, so the odds of a double recessive carrier of the "collie gene" is much lower. Which is why most huskies can be dosed at the 200 microgram per Kg bw level without side effects. But, not all. It's still a bit of a crap shoot. (There's also the issue of a reaction to the carrier, which almost never gets discussed. But, in a huge population of living organisms, there's always a chance that a freak or two will react to the carrier, not the drug, yet the rarity of the event will falsly implicate the drug.)
We have Australian Shepherds. Because they are far more intelligent than I, I give them Heartguard Plus with impunity. To my knowledge, there are only two reported cases of Aussie deaths from ivermectin overdose. They were published in the 90s and both died of "Cowboy Disease." They were given massive doses of horse ivermectin (in Montana, to boot). Far more than the 200 microgram lethal dose in collies. So the purebred breeders freaked out and the grapevine hummed and now no Aussies ever get any ivermectin and I'm an inhumane, money-grubbing vet. Sigh.
More later.
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 3:02:07 PM
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Stop the presses! I just realized I stated that the heartworm prevention dose for ivermectin is 4 micrograms per kilogram body weight. It is not. It is a minimum of 6 micrograms per kg bw. I have no idea why I wrote 4. My apologies to the anal retentive who went scurrying back to their notes and manuals.
Again, the heartworm prevention dose of ivermectin is 6 micrograms per kilogram body weight.
I guess I'll take a break from this and read up on "Other Signs of Dementia."
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 5:45:50 PM
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Honey, I'm home! Back from checking our lake's clarity with the Secchi disk for our watershed association - 18 feet of clarity at 77 degrees F surface temp. 81 degrees at our swimming beach over a hard, sandy bottom. I live on one of the cleanest and clearest lakes in Minnesota, despite the fact that it's as warm as bathwater for swimming. And it supports great game fishing despite its clarity. Go ahead. Hate me. I'm a man. I can take it.
Now back to ivermectin. It's not nearly as confusing as the other writers would have you believe.
First, there are only two basic ways to use ivermectin. One is for heartworm prevention and the other is to kill adult "round" worms - hooks and whips, for instance, are also "round" in shape, just like the Nematodes, or true round worms. Ivermectin does not kill "flat" worms like flukes and tapes. (For the moment, forget using it to kill microfilaria in a heartworm positive dog. That just muddies the water for this discussion. Also forget its use with ectoparasites, like mange, for now.)
So two ways: Heartworm prevention. Killing adult "round"-shaped worms. That's all you need to know about that.
Now, if you are going to use it to kill adult "round" worms, you need to use it at the 200 microgram per kilogram body weight dosage. (Yes, some worms are susceptible at the 100 microgram per kilogram body weight dose and some require up to 400 micrograms per kg bw, but they are the minority and you can discuss them with me or your veterinarian if you can't seem to kill the buggers.) But, to keep it simple just remember that adult "round" worms for the most part are killed at the 200 microgram per kg bw dose.
First, the good news: that is the same dosage as the injectable dose which is used for cattle and sheep and swine, etc. Therefore, whatever the dose amount recommended on the bottle for swine, you should use for dogs.
Simple. If the bottle says give 1 milliliter (ml or cc - cubic centimeter)to a 110-pound cow, then give that much to a 110-pound dog. Give half that much (1/2 or 0.5 ml or cc) to a 55-pound dog. Give 4/10s (0.4 cc) that much to a 44-pound dog, etc. Whatever the bottle says to do for a cow, do for a dog.
Now the bad news: One, that dosage will kill a certain percentage of dogs carrying both "collie" genes which code for putting "holes" in the blood/brain barrier. And dogs carrying only one gene allele at that locus will be less but still susceptible. Two, I never encouraged you to use the drug this way. It is an unapproved dosage and neither I nor the manufacturer nor Sled Dog Central nor the Easter Bunny will be liable if you choose to use an unlabeled drug in an unapproved fashion. You are completely on your own and I am officially telling you publically not to use the drug this way because you can kill your dog this way.
Now, should you ignore my professional counsel and choose to use ivermectin at the high, unapproved dose, note that you will need to redose in a month to kill the immature worms (actually ivermectin has pretty good larvicidal activity against the immatures). And, again in two months for the slower developing whip worms, if that's what your problem is.
In addition, because 200 micrograms is 33.3 times greater than the approved 6 microgram dose necessary for heartworm prevention, some mushers simply give the drug every month to: one, kill the second stage heartworm larvae migrating to the dog's heart, and two, kill any adult "round" worms in the dog.
This is a great way to control most worm problems. It is also way overkill. One, you are preventing heartworms with 33 times the amount of a potentially lethal drug needed and, two, you are killing "round" worms month after month after month. Most things only die once. Except James Bond. And the Terminator, of course.
If you really feel the need to kill adult "round" worms over and over and over again, the problem is not the drug, it is your animal husbandry, kennel design, diet, moisture and sunlight control, fly and rodent control, scooping schedule, etc. etc. etc. Drug addicts don't win the Quest. Those who pay attention to detail do.
Ivermectin has risks and is not a substitute for good animal care with lots of stooping for scooping the pooping. In addition, as stated before by me and others, there are many other approved substances on the market. And finally, one can always refer back to the testing schedule I wrote about earlier and test your dogs at lower dosages, looking for subtle signs of central nervous system depression., then increasing the dose the next month.
Time for a breather and then I'll finish up with bulk use of ivermectin for heartworm prevention, which is legal.
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 07/25/2004 : 7:06:53 PM
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Back again and refreshed. First, a quickie, why use Panacur if you're using Strongid and Ivermectin? Because Panacur will get the rodent-vectored tape worms, the Taenia. (See one of my never-ending epistles above.) Just remember Panacur won't get flea/louse-vectored tapes nor the cystic form of tapes lethal to humans. (Also, Panacur will get Giardia, but I think it needs to be used for five days running for Giardia, not three. And it tastes terrible compared with ivermectin and nemex/strongid. Not that I sit around with Martha Stewart tasting all this stuff!
Now for bulk heartworm prevention. First, in a graceful nod to all the tech weanies out there, I'll go through some basic calculations so you don't go through slide rule withdrawl.
A 1% solution is a 1 gram per deciliter solution. A deciliter is 1/10 of a liter or 100 milliliters (A liter is 1000 mls). In other words, one gram per 100 mls. One gram is 1000 miligrams. So a one percent solution is 1000 miligrams per 100 mls. Okay so far?
Now, if we divide everything by 100, then a 1% solution would equal 10 milligrams per milliliter. Still with me?
A milligram equals 1000 micrograms, so there would be 10,000 micrograms in a milliliter or 5,000 micrograms in half a milliliter (0.5 ml.), 4000 micrograms in 4/10 of a ml or cc., etc.
Now, if a dog needs 200 micrograms per kilogram body weight of ivermectin to kill adult "round" worms, and the dog weighs 25 kilograms (55 pounds), then we multiply 200 times 25 and get 5000 micrograms. So a 55-pound (25 kg) dog would get 5000 micrograms of ivermectin and we already know that a half milliliter (0.5 cc)of 1% solution holds 5000 micrograms. So we give the dog a half ml or cc of the solution.
If the dog weighs 44 pounds (20 kg) then he should get 20 kgs times 200 ucgs or 4000 ucgs of ivermectin. This would require 0.4 ml of a 1% solution.
However, we've already agreed in a previous "War and Peace" that the 200 microgram dosage is unapproved and perhaps unnecessary for killing adult "Round" worms, but we do want to use it for preventing an infection with heartworms.
We know that the minimum dose required for heartworm prevention is 6 micrograms per kilogram body weight. We also know that the minimum dose to give a susceptible collie is less than 50 micrograms per kilogram body weight. So, let's set our boundaries between 6 and 50 and cheat south toward the 6 -- in case the collie genes are really strong and the dog is really weanie.
If a 55-pound (25 kilogram) dog is treated with heartworm prevention he will need between 6 and 50 multiplied by 25, or from 150 to 1,250 micrograms of ivermectin. Since we know that a 1% solution of ivermectin contains 10,000 micrograms in one ml, then we would divide 150 and 1,250 by 10,000.
Yikes! The dog would be administered a mere 0.015 to 0.125 milliliters of 1% solution. Pretty tiny amount. Even using a "tuberculin" syringe that only goes up to one ml would be difficult.
The base carrier for ivermectin is often propylene glycol. If you mix nine parts of the carrier with one part of a 1% solution you can increase the amount of preventive ten times. That is more workable. Now the 55-pound dog would get 0.15 mls to 1.25 mls of the new 0.1% solution.
However, remember that we want to cheat downward from the sub-lethal 50 microgram dose. Also remember that the dose in a single Heartguard tablet ranges from 11.5 ucg/kg bw for a 26-pound dog to 5.9 ucg/kg bw for a 50-pound dog (sorta one size fits all for marketing). So you want to aim your dose toward around 12 - 15 ucg/kg bw.
Thus, a 55-pound dog would get between 0.3 ml and 0.37 ml of a 1% solution cut to a 0.1% solution with a 1:9 dilution.
If you print this out and follow the math, you can substitute the other commercial concentrations, such as 0.08%, etc., then have some one else check your math.
If you don't have collie genes doubling up, you can screw up by quite a bit because the safety margin for ivermectin in normal dogs is extremely wide. If you only own a handful of dogs, why not just buy the Heartguard and be dollar-wise and penny foolish for a change.
Okay, I'm outa here. I own my own business and a crueler mistress was never had. See you in a few weeks.
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SG
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 08/31/2004 : 3:40:26 PM
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Thanks for all of the great and helpful information Jerry, Juice and everyone! Hope to see you again this year in Fort Kent Jerry!!
I guess in reading all of the information shared here I was wondering what people have used for treatment of lungworms. Has anyone every used a course of Ivomec or have people generally used the 10-14 day Tx with fenbendazole?
The long and short of it is I have an older male who was running “hot” this fall (has never ran hot in previous years) and has coughed/snorted a couple of times after running. His coat isn’t that great and his breathing didn’t appear to be baseline for him when I ran him. He hasn’t presented anything that I have observed in the dog yard and I am wondering if it is lungworm. There was a kennel in my area that has previously had problems with lungworm and I was wondering if he might have picked this up. I am not sure if anything will show up in a fecal float because of regular worming but I am going to check. What have people used to treat lungworm?
Thanks,
Shawn
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2004 : 3:47:21 PM
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Shawn,
There's more than one kind of lung worm. What kind did the other kennel have? In addition, many intestinal worms migrate through the lungs as juveniles on their way from the intestine back to the intestine. They can be very destructive when doing so, causing a "verminous pneumonia."
There also are lots of other things causing lung problems, from allergens in the environment to bacteria to viruses to chemicals and gasses to heart failure to cancer.
Your first step should be towards the local veterinary clinic and include the dog's deworming history -- depending on what you've been using, you still may get eggs on a fecal exam.
Then, there's always a trachael wash for culturing live critters in the airways and then radiographs of the chest, including the heart.
Steroid therapy will calm an allergic lung but fire up an infection -- sort of a bass ackwards way of diagnosing something and usually not done on purpose. But, we've accidentally learned stuff that way.
Save your treatment questions until the very end, when you are sure of what you've got. Drugs are easy. Mysteries are not. You can buy drugs on the internet. You can't buy a good vet that way.
Sorry to preach again, but it's almost Sunday and I've got to get in the mood.
I can smell fall already!
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SG
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2004 : 07:06:50 AM
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G’day,
Your input is very helpful, not preaching!
I’m not sure but I believe it was Capillaria aerophilia….
I am not planning on treating anything until I have a good understanding of what is going on and hopefully an accurate diagnosis. I have quarterly fecals done and nothing has really ever come up. I followed up with my local vet and she won’t do a trachael wash so I am going to head south to another clinic that I believe will do them.
I am pretty sure I have ruled out environmental factors although I was running him in one of those new guard harnesses and switched him back to an X-back, which has decreased his symptoms.
I just want to rule out as much as I can before going in. I’ll make sure to follow up here as soon as I get anything.
Thank you,
Shawn
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Dr. Jerry Vanek
149 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2004 : 4:29:51 PM
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Shawn,
Glad you're pushing the envelope. Capillaria aerophila is the fox lungworm, where it can be devastating in captive fur farms. Dogs and cats can get it.
You're right about not finding eggs. If you're treating with ivermectin at the high dose or fenbendazole at the regular dose the worms will be killed and there won't be any eggs. But, of course there won't be any worms, disease or coughing either!!!
So it could be something else. If you haven't treated with an anthelmintic for a while and it is lung worms, a broncheal wash is problably not necessary. You should find worms in the feces. However, they look very much like whip worm eggs to the untrained eye. Even vets. And if the vet techs doing the fecals were not whacked over the head by Gary Averbeck down at the U of Minnesota, who was a real stickler, they might be misdiagnosing lung worm as whipworm. Of course, the treatment is the same (see above).
Good luck, and if you're pregnant, Happy Labor Day!
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SG
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 10:36:16 AM
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Hello again,
I just wanted to follow up after my visit with the older guy who was running a bit warm. Nothing came up… everything came back negative.
I have run him a few times since then and he appears to be running better. The only thing I can come up with was the new guard harness I was running him in. It did change his gait and I am thinking that it changed his gait to a point that affected his respiration and breathing in someway or that he was working harder with the change in gait. The coughing and such has not occurred again and I am going to mark up to environmental factors at this point. We’ll see what happens.
Thanks again for your input and thoughts.
Shawn
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Wayne Hall
USA
109 Posts |
Posted - 09/26/2004 : 01:54:15 AM
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Dr. Vanek:
Last years moose and this years moose that I harvested both had cystic tapeworm. If I ate a piece of this meat with a cyst that was not cooked, or cooked well will I get tapeworm? A previous post of yours says if a human ate the feces he would become the host. I just don't get it? I thought you had to eat the cyst in the meat? Scarlett and I are both trying to figure this out. Panacur will not kill this tapeworm, right? Thank you
Wayne Hall
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Ivomec, Strongid & Panacur
